In January 2019 we were planning a public event with Anna Minton and Richard Seymour, discussing the aftermath of the December 2019 general election and the then-ongoing Labour Party leadership election. We had to cancel the event because of a problem with the venue and instead recorded a conversation between Anna, Richard and Jeremy as a podcast a few weeks later. This was all before the Covid-19 crisis struck and before the leadership election was resolved. Also, I had a heavy cold while we were doing it (no, it wasn’t Covid). Still, there were many interesting insights from Anna and Richard that we thought worth preserving, so here it is.